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Who Did Not Snort the Fairy Dust? And Why?

a moderate set up, 500-550 grains will get you flat shooting arrows and pass thru shots. Its just a little heavier & doesn't lose speed as fast as lighter arrows. Probably 15-20% Foc. It works well. Mike
 
mspaci said:
a moderate set up, 500-550 grains will get you flat shooting arrows and pass thru shots. Its just a little heavier & doesn't lose speed as fast as lighter arrows. Probably 15-20% Foc. It works well. Mike
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I took a middle of the road approach. 100 grain brass inserts in a 340 spine Axis arrow. 100 grain Black Hornets. A little under 500 grains with a 26" draw length.
 
I am a tinkerer by nature. I like messing with things and improving through DIY almost to a fault. That being said and its worth mentioning that I am new to archery hunting, so take my opinion on this as you will.

I am aware of the 'fairy dust' thing but only slightly, as in I know what the general idea is. I have almost zero interest in it. I have the arrows I bought when I bought my bow. I did a crap load of research and a lot of asking around about what kind of broadhead to use. So far I'm 2/2 this season with pass throughs and easy recoveries. If it's not broke, dont fix it. I know enough to know to leave well enough alone. I'm not interested in taking long shots or questionable shots and the arrows im using work just fine. This is my answer to the original question.
 
Chimney7 said:
I am a tinkerer by nature. I like messing with things and improving through DIY almost to a fault. That being said and its worth mentioning that I am new to archery hunting, so take my opinion on this as you will.

I am aware of the 'fairy dust' thing but only slightly, as in I know what the general idea is. I have almost zero interest in it. I have the arrows I bought when I bought my bow. I did a crap load of research and a lot of asking around about what kind of broadhead to use. So far I'm 2/2 this season with pass throughs and easy recoveries. If it's not broke, dont fix it. I know enough to know to leave well enough alone. I'm not interested in taking long shots or questionable shots and the arrows im using work just fine. This is my answer to the original question.
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That's a great attitude with the"if it ain't broke don't fix it" idea until you make a bad shot or the deer moves before the arrow gets there and you hit his shoulder or elsewhere that you didn't want to hit. Or your shot is deflected by a twig you didn't see. It hasn't happened to you yet but it will. You might start thinking then that it is broke and does need fixing. I'm not saying that your current set up will not be enough to compensate for that because you didn't share what your setup is but that stuff does happen and when it does then being "over arrowed" might just save the day. While I'm at it I would like to address the huge drop in arrow poi everybody seems to complain about. If you don't shoot your rig enough to know where that arrow is gonna hit at a certain yardage then you shouldn't be taking that shot anyways. I have shot with just one pin for the last 30 some odd years and I have missed maybe 2 or 3 deer in my that time. Those shots were all missed because of my form being bad ( made a bad release, dropped my bow arm etc)not because I missed judged the distance or didn't know where my arrow would hit.
 
Why am I still following this drivel?? It seems like it has gone away from the OP's initial request. Not related to the OP's request....

1. I've seen deer hit by automobiles and still survive with broken leg(s). I've also seen deer drag themselves off into a swamp with broken rear legs to get away. The can actually run pretty fast on only two front legs.

Deer have an amazing will to survive that most of us will never understand or witness.

2. Use Ashby's findings as a guideline to aid in your setup if you want. If you're happy with a 400 grain arrow so be it. If you want to shoot 1200 grains that's fine too.

3. I think the biggest issue with bow hunting is shot placement and practice. If you don't have the time to practice, then maybe gun hunt or use a crossbow.

Just curious how many crossbow hunters are using a 650+ grain arrow?

4. I still think lighter, smaller diameter arrows will will out penetrate thicker heavier arrows. I know from personal experience that my Easton Axis arrows with expandables have done better than my Easton 2216s with COC heads. I still remember the 2216s sticking out (rib cage) as each deer I shot ran away.

That has not been the case with the Axis arrows. Each 1 was buried into the ground (6+ inches) except 1 deer I spined with the axis arrows (tree limb deflection).

All shot with the same bow.

5. I'm one of the people that can not stand ranch fairy. He just rubs me the wrong way. I can't make it past the 2 minute mark in any of his videos.

6. I don't need an arrow to shoot hogs only whitetails. Hogs don't exist where I hunt. I do need an arrow though for elk hunting next year, which will become my new whitetail setup. My current setup and arrows have lasted me almost 20 years. Not bad for 2 dozen arrows.

I'll be shooting Victory Vap TKO or the Vap SS. My goal is for around total arrow weight to be 520-550 grains. Most likely with 125 grain heads and 75-135 grain ethics inserts. Not sure what the FOC will be on this setup.

7. I will not test out ethics "ranch fairy" testing kit. I will order the ethics inserts and broadheads I need/want. I will make the arrows to the weight I'm wanting. I will then tune my arrow to my bow, which reminds me I need to make some new strings for my bow this winter too.




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I guess the Abraham's MBT AP arrow guys and I will have to politely agree to disagree
I see no reason and absolutely no justification what se ever to discard $100's of dollars of perfectly good arrows and FBBH's that fly wonderfully well out to 50 yards have allowed me to recover 96% of the deer I shot with aluminum arrows and 100% of every deer I have shot since going to carbons over 25 years ago.
I see absolutely no disadvantage of a 437grn TWA going 268fps as confirmed by my Chronograph that is generating 69ft/lbs KE to kill any deer including elk.
If anyone wishes to use arrows whos total weight is 500 to 600grns or more I sincerely and truly mean it when I say great that is your prerogative I just see no advantages worth the loss in bow performance FOR ME to make doing so even remotely worth it

I upgrade to a faster more efficient compound so I could shoot a faster same weight arrow at a significantly lower draw weight (58 VS 70) that was 10 years and 3 compound bows ago and all I did was change compound bows I changed nothing else and still made use of the over $500 I had invested in arrows and FBBH's
I have absolutely no doubt what you guys shooting super heavy arrows say is true where we differ in opinion and beliefs is I personally see no evidence convincing enough to me to feel the benefits complel me to change.

And I can not stand the " Ranch Fairy" only difference I can see between they way he conducts himself and his videos and those in the WWE is there are no midget wrestlers in the RF videos at least not YET
I kid you not the very first RF video I ever watched I was 1000% confident that any second Randy Machoman Savage was gonna burst through some paper and try to sell some Slim jim beef jerkey I kid you not.
 
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Nutterbuster said:
That was not a good angle. Not sure what arrow/broadhead he was using, or if a different one would have changed that outcome. The ribs were basically all stacked, and it glanced off.

Might could have got a better shot opportunity if the deer wasn't friggin looking at him the whole time.
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Totally Agree - This is a shot that should have never been taken. Equipment would not have mattered as the angle was so poor. He just shot at ribs. A heavy arrow would have just done the same thing. A light or heavy arrow probably would broke the Deer's rib and that is it.
 
The funny thing is that long before the fairy started spouting off, there were a lot of people shooting high FOC!! Ecsp the trad community, its nothing new and really not necessary for whitetails. I have shot high FOC for at least 20 years out of both compounds and my recurves...The funny thing is if I were to shoot an expandable broadhead I would want more FOC than with a traditional broadhead. I get tired of guys not getting two holes and god forbid someone shoulder shoot a deer with their 350 grain arrow with a rage going 300fps and wonder why they lost it.. I like a fairly heavy arrow, medium speed and a quiet bow and you do not need high foc to get a fairly heavy arrow. Shawn
 
You also have to take evrything you read on here and anywhere else with a grain of salt., The guys who say they have misseed 2 or 3 deer in the last 30 years may have only shot at 30 or 40 deer in that time. The guy who says I never lost one to a bad hit may have only shot at 40 or 50 deer in their lives. Shot placement is very important but no way are you hitting where you hold everytime. I killed my first whitetail buck in 1977 with a 42# Wing recurve and a Bear broadhead. I was 12, blew through him like butter!! I never thought about FOC or even how much my arrow weighed and the deer did not care either. As I progressed in my hunting and started killing a lot of deer I learned a few things and the most important is to have confidence in what you are shooting and know what has worked for you and not really care what all the so called experts say or think cause a lot of them have killed 30 or 50 deer their whole life and think they know it all!! Shawn
 
bj139 said:
This is one issue where I think, "If it ain't broke don't fix it". Perhaps if I hit a deer in heavy bone and have trouble recovering it I will change my mind.
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you will, especially if like me you have to hear the deer cry out in pain for 45 minutes while you sit in your almost in tears because you feel so bad.
 
One important point nobody ever wants to talk about is that when you shoot at a deer you are shooting at a moving target. There are tons of videos of deer being shot that show they pretty much all react to the shot, aka jump the string. It doesn't matter how fast your set up is either. That is why I always aim for the top of the heart not middle of the lungs where the 10 ring is on 3d targets,
 
I added 50 grain brass inserts to my set up this year (Easton axis 5mm) and 125 day six heads. I’m impressed. I shot my biggest buck to date in the shoulder and got a full pass through. I don’t think I would have got that with my old mechanical set up. I moved up to about 14% FOC and I think it was worth it.
 
One thing about this whole conversation......which probably needed a poke from someone to start i.e. Ranch Ferry, is that people were shooting light setups with mechanical broadheads. This IMO caused some bad problems in wounding deer and alot of hunters crying LOL. People are more aware their setup and what is going on with their arrows ability to penetrate.....broadhead sharpness.....total weight and bow tuning. This is exactly what the ethical hunter needs to apply to their setup. Like him or not.....we are talking about how to make our stuff a better killer .....isn't that what we all want? We spend countless hrs preparing for the moment of truth.....let's make the best of it. It's all gain if we do so.
 
BigAl said:
One thing about this whole conversation......which probably needed a poke from someone to start i.e. Ranch Ferry, is that people were shooting light setups with mechanical broadheads. This IMO caused some bad problems in wounding deer and alot of hunters crying LOL. People are more aware their setup and what is going on with their arrows ability to penetrate.....broadhead sharpness.....total weight and bow tuning. This is exactly what the ethical hunter needs to apply to their setup. Like him or not.....we are talking about how to make our stuff a better killer .....isn't that what we all want? We spend countless hrs preparing for the moment of truth.....let's make the best of it. It's all gain if we do so.
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Absolutely!
 
DMT, 100% of deer recovered in the last 25 years?? Either you don't shoot many or are very, very lucky!! I know probably 40 guys who bowhunt only and have known many of them for 25 years or more. I assure you none of them are 100% on recovery of deer shot in that time, none. Most of these guys kill several deer a year but as I said the odds of not losing a deer in all that time is very rare. I 100 percent agree with a fairly heavy arrow but the high FOC on whitetails is a non issue. I shoot 190 grains up front but have been doing that long before the fairy strated his fairy tale! Shawn
 
Fairy dust for me! I always shot heavy out of my recurve and 47” Hoyt round wheel compound. Ranch fairy got me to load up the front, now I’m 300 up front and 650 total weight. I shoot finger’s on both bows, my groups tightened up, broad heads fly perfect, and I blew through a couple deer. Sold.....
Do the math on your setup,
Speed squared x mass( total arrow weight) Divided by 450240 = foot pounds of kinetic energy
My setup on the Hoyt is
200x200 FPS = 40,000
X 650 gr. = 26,000,000
Divided by 450240 = 57.74 foot pounds of kinetic energy.
My bow is dead quiet, and most of my deer kills are under 20 yds.


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Deerman406 said:
You also have to take evrything you read on here and anywhere else with a grain of salt., The guys who say they have misseed 2 or 3 deer in the last 30 years may have only shot at 30 or 40 deer in that time. The guy who says I never lost one to a bad hit may have only shot at 40 or 50 deer in their lives. Shot placement is very important but no way are you hitting where you hold everytime. I killed my first whitetail buck in 1977 with a 42# Wing recurve and a Bear broadhead. I was 12, blew through him like butter!! I never thought about FOC or even how much my arrow weighed and the deer did not care either. As I progressed in my hunting and started killing a lot of deer I learned a few things and the most important is to have confidence in what you are shooting and know what has worked for you and not really care what all the so called experts say or think cause a lot of them have killed 30 or 50 deer their whole life and think they know it all!! Shawn
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No comment on Fairy Dust.

Just a comment on sample set. A guy who has “only” shot 40 or 50 deer in his life, who hunts for trophy bucks, in a state that allows one buck, has 40-50 years of experience targeting hard to kill deer.

Sure, there are states where you can take like 10 deer a year. I don’t necessarily know why the percentage success would change as the sample set increases, unless hunters in those states have a less discretionary attitude due to such wonton opportunities.

I agree that if it consistently works for you, who cares what others tell you to do. But, unless you think it’s BS, maybe some of these hunters who have only taken 30-50 deer their whole life actually are good hunters and know a thing or two too.
 
So guys at 17 start out as trophy hunters and only kill mature bucks. Doubtful but ok, also hunting mid west bucks in states who allow only one buck is not rocker science. Give most guys with a brain in their head a full season in the Midwest, and quite few will kill a good buck. It's not that hard to kill a good buck every year. Even on public it ain't that hard. Bring a "great whitetail hunter" from say Iowa and see how he does on public land in say NJ, NY, Mass. I promise you most will struggle to kill a 2 5 year old. Shawn
 
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