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Why don't yall 2TC?

I searched for 2TC on Saddlehunter and ran up against the 3 letter limit on searches.

I searched directly on Duckduckgo by typing "2TC site:saddlehunter.com" to get all the results. No quotes when searching.
 
My thoughts after less than a month into 2TC with backyard climbs/descents and no rappel. Assembling gear for the rappel though I find the descent easy enough and I may not rappel, we'll see.
@Red Beard & @always89y videos as well as a few messages was all I needed for instruction & gear assembly.
My first few climbs/descents were with @always89y amsteel DIY main tether. I later tried my lineman's belt and found the stiffer rope easier to move up & down the tree plus I feel more comfortable being tethered with it; more weight & bulk but I'll accept that tradeoff.
I got glove material caught in the tether on my first attempt. Zip Ties or other devices for moving the main tether is a must for safety.
I had my foot on tether kick out once while descending and that was a little exciting but I knew I wasn't going anywhere since I was tethered in. I use short movements now which I believe reduces effort, gives me more stability, & my foot remains in the foot tether which I feel is a plus; slow & steady works for me.
2TC, Saddle & ROS will be my method for some Elk sits this Fall because it works and I can transition to spot & stalk with less bulk if I encounter Elk on my way in.
Thank you @Red Beard & @always89y for the videos & tips!
 
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bj139 said:
I searched for 2TC on Saddlehunter and ran up against the 3 letter limit on searches.

I searched directly on Duckduckgo by typing "2TC site:saddlehunter.com" to get all the results. No quotes when searching.
Click to expand...
BJ, search Ultra Light Climbing Method 2.0 sir.
 
If you use teufelberger platinum line as a long tether
..would that be too stiff? My main climbing method currently is SRT so I already have that rope and for emergency trips to the ground you can get back up quickly.
 
flysar said:
My thoughts after less than a month into 2TC with backyard climbs/descents and no rappel. Assembling gear for the rappel though I find the descent easy enough and I may not rappel, we'll see.
@Red Beard & @always89y videos as well as a few messages was all I needed for instruction & gear assembly.
My first few climbs/descents were with @always89y amsteel DIY main tether. I later tried my lineman's belt and found the stiffer rope easier to move up & down the tree plus I feel more comfortable being tethered with it; more weight & bulk but I'll accept that tradeoff.
I got glove material caught in the tether on my first attempt. Zip Ties or other devices for moving the main tether is a must for safety.
I had my foot on tether kick out once while descending and that was a little exciting but I knew I wasn't going anywhere since I was tethered in. I use short movements now which I believe reduces effort, gives me more stability, & my foot remains in the foot tether which I feel is a plus; slow & steady works for me.
2TC, Saddle & ROS will be my method for some Elk sits this Fall because it works and I can transition to spot & stalk with less bulk if I encounter Elk on my way in.
Thank you @Red Beard & @always89y for the videos & tips!
Click to expand...
This is perfect buddy. Thank you. Yep... like you said, I've had the best success with smaller, controlled movements.
 
This thread inspired me to try 2TC for the first time this morning. I didn’t have a leg loop but I found it to be easier than expected after watching the @Red Beard video. I just used my normal tether and an amsteel daisy chain and amsteel aider I had laying around. Without the leg loop I just had to dangle while moving my 2nd tether up which is similar to one-sticking. Overall, great experience and going to keep experimenting. Always good to have this option, especially for scouting my way into a new area. Biggest downside after 1 climb is the amount of moves it takes to get up the tree, but with a system that weighs so little it’s a fair trade off. Thanks for the inspiration.
 
I plan to try it down the road when I get more time. I think there are probobly two main reasons why 2TC hasnt become more popular. The first is that many guys have already invested a lot of time, money and energy into other systems and they are at the point where they just want to finally get totally comfortable with what they have. Second, no matter how easy you guys make it look, something about it looks difficult. There is something about the security and natural ease of standing on something solid vs hanging in the saddle or stepping on an aider. I think 2TC will grow slowly as more guys give it enough energy to get comfortable with it.
 
Climbing with 2 tethers, aiders, lone wolf sit climb as a platform has been around at least 8 to 10 years. Have three reasons why I don’t use some of these methods.
#1 fiddle factor: I like simple because you make less mistakes.
#2 speed: I like to quickly get to height with the least amount of energy. Not expending excess energy =less sweat. Which yields less smells.
Getting gear sweaty. It is easy to do with the high humidity of Florida. When I go mobile is when the temperature is in the 70.
#3 I don’t have abs of steel anymore.
 
Can we get a weight check on this system? I would include rapel gear as I don't think it would be desirable to climb down this way.

I'm guessing we are talking in the 3-4 lb range given the rapel rope and the safeguard. Maybe I'm over? Water bottle holder?

I find this idea very tempting, but since I don't already rappel, I've got to sink $150-200 (rappel rope and safeguard, plus misc components) into an experiment whose benefit might be limited to 1-3 lbs and some packability (over sticks).

I guess those are my real barriers as I think about this more. Moderate marginal cost to try something I might or might not like, and limited, if tangible, marginal benefit. I do hate packing sticks though, and the idea of just having my hang on stand and small pack on my back is very enticing.
 
sweats said:
So I tried 2 TC once years ago after Scott Adkins showed it. At the time, I tried without a leg loop and it didn't go well. I was a sweaty and tired mess by the time I was 6 feet off the ground.

I intend to try again with a leg loop, but there are a few things overall that I consider cons from what I've seen from the various videos.

Unless you have the tether handles, you have to put your fingers between the tether and the tree when advancing the tether. I'm not a fan of this when standing on the leg loop. Perhaps I won't feel as unstable when I try with a leg loop, but it is still a concern. I also hunt some larger and rough barked trees, which makes advancing the tether difficult in many cases. I'd like to figure out a way that you could introduce some rigidity to the rope so you could advance it one handed after loosening the girth hitch. However, that could present more of a safety risk if the tether has a tendency to stay open.

Finally, I see rappelling down as pretty much a necessity for ease and also should you need to make a rapid descent as the bee example above highlights. I have a GriGri+ that I use for SRT already, but the rope I use for SRT is 75 feet of 10.5 mm. The device accommodates down to 8.5 mm, so I could get a shorter length of 9mm or something to use. However, I tend to hunt the same parcels and try to pick trees ahead of time, so doing presets for SRT often makes more sense for me.

So I like the idea and I think there is a lot of potential there and appreciate the information you have shared. Yet, like every climbing method I've tried so far, I see some significant challenges and downsides.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

X2. To be honest, it could be that I was using raw equipment. Basic 2TC with Amsteel, not new or custom tailored equipment's that other have perfected for the method. Same as using RCH/Sitdrag until the explosion of actual saddles. I was sweating like crazy getting to 15 ft, and just looking down before climbing down drained me of all motivation.

Going around limbs was more trouble then I wanted to dedicate time and effort into solving.

I feel like you really need to find a good tree.

This was before decision to rappel down next season so it might be easier now. In my quest for 'ultimate' light weight I tried 2TC and straps/aider only method. I found climbing with just straps and aider was easier and it only cost the weight of an aider and 3-4 straps/quick link combo and I can get to 20+ feet. Everything will get the job done, I just think 1 stick is the right balance.

But again I'm moving away from trying to lose every ounces that I can. If carrying an extra 8 lbs. of gear in sticks is really going to hinder me so much. I should be reflecting on myself rather than my gear.
 
TNSTAAFL said:
Can we get a weight check on this system? I would include rapel gear as I don't think it would be desirable to climb down this way.

I'm guessing we are talking in the 3-4 lb range given the rapel rope and the safeguard. Maybe I'm over? Water bottle holder?

I find this idea very tempting, but since I don't already rappel, I've got to sink $150-200 (rappel rope and safeguard, plus misc components) into an experiment whose benefit might be limited to 1-3 lbs and some packability (over sticks).

I guess those are my real barriers as I think about this more. Moderate marginal cost to try something I might or might not like, and limited, if tangible, marginal benefit. I do hate packing sticks though, and the idea of just having my hang on stand and small pack on my back is very enticing.
Click to expand...
This is absolutely what I was hoping to understand. Thank you!
 
ok I got a bunch of Amsteel equivalent that @always89y recommended (slightly upgraded to 1/4" cause im chunky) and an extra 19" hollow block for the foothold. Figured I could DIY a couple daisy chains (never attempted before) toward the end of the tag end to set the hollow block into. Going to use my Sterling C-IV rope for the main/top tether and the amsteel for the lower. Only thing I need now is a thigh/leg strap which i might be able to concoct from a gun case I have.

Amazon.com : STERLING Hollow Block - 6.8mm Yellow, 19in : Sports & Outdoors

Amazon.com : STERLING Hollow Block - 6.8mm Yellow, 19in : Sports & Outdoors
www.amazon.com
 
So, I have attempted one climb and it was a total train wreck for me. I have a leg loop from Jerry. It was attached to the main tether via a distel hitch. I was clipped into my rch belay loop via my safeguard below the leg loop. I had a separate tether with a distel hitch attached to a tubular webbing foot loop.

My issue seemed to be that I could never unweight my foot loop tether when transferring to the leg loop/main tether. No matter how little or how much I moved my tethers up the tree, I just couldn’t seem to transfer my weight to the rch and leg loop to be able to raise my foot loop tether.

I personally think I want to try a couple other methods in this vein. 1) using two foot loop tether and just walking up the tree. I would use 3 tether in this instance as I’d have the top/highest tether clipped into my rch foot safety. Then the two foot loop tether staggered below that. 2) Main tether hooked to rch. Then one tether with a dual stirrup foot loop. Stand up on both feet, move main tether, then unload and move feet tether.

Hopefully this all was articulated clearly

Edited above
 
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Have you guys found it easier on a slightly leaning tree to be on the top or the bottom. I've done both and it seems easier to balance for the move on the top side but more risk if you would lose your balance. What have you guys found?
 
Arrowsquirrel said:
Have you guys found it easier on a slightly leaning tree to be on the top or the bottom. I've done both and it seems easier to balance for the move on the top side but more risk if you would lose your balance. What have you guys found?
Click to expand...
On a slightly leaning tree I find it easier to climb from the bottom side. You really have to use your leg hook to draw you close to the tree. Exactly like you said, I feel more likely to have a kick out on the high side.
 
I just started fooling with this a month or two ago. Here is what I’ve found.

First, climbing rope versus amsteel blue made moving the tethers much easier. Amsteel really grabs the tree and hangs up on bark and such.

Second, a leg band is a great add on. I tried it with out and had a hard time staying away from the tree without it. Making moving my foot tether harder.

The third things is, you have to have the main tether with your leg band and shortened bridge adjusted correctly. Meaning enough pressure on the leg band to give stability. Then adjust you bridge tether that it just starts pulling tight as you load the leg band with your weight.


Fourth, I think the first impulse is to adjust the leg band and bridge Prussics that you can’t get enough distance from the tree to easily unload and move the foot tether.

Fifth, for me to easily move the foot tether, I had to have it connected to my foot versus removing it every time. The time savings was incredible.

And finally, climb with knee pads on! It makes all the difference in the world.

Then, you just got to practice. Then practice more.


FWIW, anyone who says they think the two tether system isn’t fast, is totally uninformed and hasn’t tried it. I am not very quick at it. However, Scott Adkins has a video where he tethers in, climbs 20 feet, climbs down and unhooks in 3:41. Nothing out there is that fast.

So, tie that foot tether to your foot. Use climbing rope if amsteel isn’t your thing
Adjust everything properly before leaving the ground, use a leg band, and practice. It’s easier then any method. And, Trust your saddle and load it up while climbing if you get fatigued.
 
WV Mountaineer said:
I just started fooling with this a month or two ago. Here is what I’ve found.

First, climbing rope versus amsteel blue made moving the tethers much easier. Amsteel really grabs the tree and hangs up on bark and such.

Second, a leg band is a great add on. I tried it with out and had a hard time staying away from the tree without it. Making moving my foot tether harder.

The third things is, you have to have the main tether with your leg band and shortened bridge adjusted correctly. Meaning enough pressure on the leg band to give stability. Then adjust you bridge tether that it just starts pulling tight as you load the leg band with your weight.


Fourth, I think the first impulse is to adjust the leg band and bridge Prussics that you can’t get enough distance from the tree to easily unload and move the foot tether.

Fifth, for me to easily move the foot tether, I had to have it connected to my foot versus removing it every time. The time savings was incredible.

And finally, climb with knee pads on! It makes all the difference in the world.

Then, you just got to practice. Then practice more.


FWIW, anyone who says they think the two tether system isn’t fast, is totally uninformed and hasn’t tried it. I am not very quick at it. However, Scott Adkins has a video where he tethers in, climbs 20 feet, climbs down and unhooks in 3:41. Nothing out there is that fast.

So, tie that foot tether to your foot. Use climbing rope if amsteel isn’t your thing
Adjust everything properly before leaving the ground, use a leg band, and practice. It’s easier then any method. And, Trust your saddle and load it up while climbing if you get fatigued.
Click to expand...
This is a dead on description. Thanks WV Mountaineer.

@easttndiy


Custom Gear Modifications (CGM)
 
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